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TOPIC: Re:Is it okay to videotape the police?
#3988
photoman (User)
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Re:Is it okay to videotape the police? 5 Years, 2 Months ago  
Well mrharm you would be in the same place about four LEO's are in as we speak my friend. Named as a defendant in a civil action!

You cross a very bright line when you play games with a published freelance so if your offer for the ride and jewelry are still valid I am game! In the first place I would never run from anyone!
Second if you detain me you must have PC and just the thought that there is something on that tape is not PC any way you slice it or dice it!
Third there is technology now days that would have you so frustrated trying to acquire any useable information from my equipment it would not be worth anything more than a civil lawsuit to you.

If you or one of your jack booted thugs want to try and get the info from my camera without my permission there are ways to encrypt digital information that it would be of no value to you! So you can play nice or not – that is your call, but what to do if you do not play nice is my call and I will not fight it on the street rather a Federal Courtroom.

My video equipment records directly to a password protected hard drive and I have the capability to send it wirelessly to a remote receiver, which I do frequently just in case some one attempts to take my equipment, do you get it yet?

In the first case I am under no obligation to give you a password whatever the circumstances are! That has been attempted in courts and the answer was a resounding NO!
In the second case you will have to find where the information was transmitted to before you are able to retrieve it. Then you have another problem if you are able to find it, that darn password again!

Your first job is to maintain the scene correct? If you are harassing a photog then you are not doing your job! BTW have you ever heard of the federal Shield Laws?

Let me clue you in why I have such distain for LEO's that try to bully me and steal my work! Freelance work off their nickel first so the work is a financial gain! You have no more right to commandeer my equipment than you do taking a hotdog from the corner street vendor. If you hinder my ability to make a living I certainly will not be cooperative, and should you decide you want to push out your chest and say too bad you have no choice, I have a solution for that problem as well, read above concerning you being able to retrieve the information from my camera!

I hope this explains it in terms you understand... I will not be told you must give me your work by any LEO - what transpires from that point on is a matter that we neither one will work out in the streets, so make it easy on yourself and play nice or you could be shown that the badge you think holds all the power, holds no more power than the people who pay you decide it holds!

Don't just blindly take my word for it brother - go to the following link and you will find the real story on what you are allowed to do and what is not allowed. This was written by a lawyer friend of mine Bert P.Krages. http://www.krages.com/phoright.htm

My suit is over a legal image shot from the street of public property, no cop was around when it was created but when the image appeared on a website they decided to harass me to the point of slandering me to a few people that have come forward and have gave statements.

When they illegally detained and arrested me, they held me for over two hours and no questions were asked concerning any illegal activities (I have a copy of the entire two hours in transcripts - so does the FBI and AG's office). I was never charged with any crime and the FBI laughed their butts off when they got the "offence report" forwarded by the LEO, who attempted to have me arrested for cyber stalking… this was after I was investigated for gaining access to a public document that had been hidden in a sheriff’s desk drawer for many years. Now the AG and the FBI are involved and it doesn’t look so good for the boys in blue, especially the sheriff who may be soon charged with Obstruction of Justice - Malfeasance in Office - Injuring Public Records and a host of other charges!

I am all for the criminals being caught and the victims winning - if that is possible - I am also very aware that the people that take on the task of upholding the law will not ever abuse me again without a court battle.

As for the "go away money" I don't go away for money, and that scares the bejeezus out of the ones I have the action filed on! You know something is not on the up and up when the defendants will not answer the discovery request and are begging for more time, even to the point they wanted me to agree to a new scheduling order which would have set off the bench trial! You see the ball is in my court now, well mine and a Federal Judge's court, and these guys will pay for their violation of my civil rights with more than money I promise you that!
 
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#3991
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Re:Is it okay to videotape the police? 5 Years, 2 Months ago  
Food said: "Not true, believe it or not there are a few states with laws that prohibit taking videos of public employees without their permission. These laws are being challenged as we post."



I don't understand how a state law can override the First Amendment.
 
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Last Edit: 2008/03/31 21:28 By CarlosMiller.
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#3992
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Re:Is it okay to videotape the police? 5 Years, 2 Months ago  
Photo,

I would love to write about your case on my blog.
www.carlosmiller.com
 
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#4013
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Re:Is it okay to videotape the police? 5 Years, 2 Months ago  
CarlosMiller wrote:
QUOTE:
Food said: "Not true, believe it or not there are a few states with laws that prohibit taking videos of public employees without their permission. These laws are being challenged as we post."



I don't understand how a state law can override the First Amendment.

@Carlos:
There has just not been any case law on it yet! The Federal system trumps the local and state laws and ordinances every time!

No one has taken these states to task and made a case that will hold as case law at this time. When it happens then the "qualified immunity" that now exist for those LEO's will be no more in this situation!

Quite honestly if LE is using video in an area that has these laws, they are breaking the law! It will take someone with brass cods to stand up to them and make a case in a court that supersedes their authority. Then and only then will the laws have to be revised to meet federal guidelines or they will find their way back in the same situation very quickly!

Qualified Immunity has been a crutch for LE for many years - the first answer to any civil action against LE is qualified immunity. Which when translated means, even if we broke the law or violated a persons rights we can't be held liable. Which is a total crock!

In my case I filed actions on them professionally and personally! I see the writing on the wall already - they will try as hard as they can to get me to settle out of court so the department’s insurance carrier pays the whole ball of wax! Too bad so sad, it is not going to end that way for them! I am not in any binds for cash, I do very well working freelance!
 
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#4254
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Re:Is it okay to videotape the police? 5 Years, 2 Months ago  
It is not ok to video tape the police.

Look at the trouble that was caused by the king videotape.

If a person has a brain, even if it is the size of a spider monkeys brain, they should know not to run from the police, and not to disrespect the police in any way.

I would like to see the news media show the video tape of the Korean grocer that king beat with a tire iron. THAT POOR HARD WORKING FAMILY MAN, WAS SCARRED FOR LIFE BY king.

Either you are on the side of good, or the side of evil. TAKE YOUR PICK. But you can't have it both ways.

I know there are bad cops out there, so what. Why drag the team down over a few bad players?

Even bad cops can do good things.
 
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#4259
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Re:Is it okay to videotape the police? 5 Years, 2 Months ago  
Mike, You know what cops learned from the king video.
We learned two important lessons. 1 if something is not working, try something different. 2 This is was PCP does to the human body.
From a LEO's perspective, those cops were WRONG, but we learn lessons from others mistakes and poor choices.
 
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3 B's of Law Enforcement
Be Respectful
Be Professional
Be Ready to Kill Anyone at Anytime
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#4271
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Re:Is it okay to videotape the police? 5 Years, 2 Months ago  
what about the 3rd thing learned, NOT to let people keep tapes when something wrong or maybe wrong was done by a LEO
 
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#4306
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Re:Is it okay to videotape the police? 5 Years, 2 Months ago  
Read the bold red text in your quote.
You are right - you can't have it both ways. A bad cop is a worthless leach on public assistance! What a mumbo jumbo waste of space your post was!

Where do you get your news? I bet it is not your local PD! Journalist and the public have the right to a free press, read the US Constitution it's in plain wording that even you can understand... or maybe not?



mikehunter wrote:
QUOTE:
It is not ok to video tape the police.

Look at the trouble that was caused by the king videotape.

If a person has a brain, even if it is the size of a spider monkeys brain, they should know not to run from the police, and not to disrespect the police in any way.

I would like to see the news media show the video tape of the Korean grocer that king beat with a tire iron. THAT POOR HARD WORKING FAMILY MAN, WAS SCARRED FOR LIFE BY king.

Either you are on the side of good, or the side of evil. TAKE YOUR PICK. But you can't have it both ways.

I know there are bad cops out there, so what. Why drag the team down over a few bad players?

Even bad cops can do good things.
 
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#4410
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Re:Is it okay to videotape the police? 5 Years, 2 Months ago  
Say mine three times and click your heels together and you may wind up in Kansas! Looks as if you are constantly saying your name fast because you are the total definition of the resulting rhetoric.

Your attitude and inability to form a sentence that is even remotely grammatically correct, not to mention your reasoning abilities, have now been placed on display for all to see.

QUOTE:
"either your on the side of good, or the side of evil. Take your pick. But you can't have it both ways.


THEN IN THE SAME POST YOU WRITE:

QUOTE:
"even bad cops can do good things"


Not only does it not make any sense, it shows what a well educated person you are! Hope you were not out smoking dope when your parents were paying for your education, that stuff rots your brain to the point you have no reasoning ability, ask any cop serving in the War on Drugs!


mikehunter wrote:
QUOTE:
photoman

say my name "Mike Hunt" real fast three times. you have just described your body part and my last name describes your attitude.
 
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#4480
photoman (User)
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Re:Is it okay to videotape the police? 5 Years, 2 Months ago  
Throw mud at a real American?
Let me clue you in, a real American stands up for justice and from your post you don't believe in that! The only thing you have done since you appeared here is troll me, so that says a lot for ya buddy!

QUOTE:
i might be going to dinner at the white house

That statement and a dollar will buy you a donut! You should have spent more money on an education - you don't even use the English Language well do you? Most people that have at least a third grade education know to capitalize a proper name and place! I see at least five cases of you not doing that in this post alone...

Actually I support Huckabee and have had a lot of interaction with him. What does that say for me - nothing except I am involved in the process - win lose or draw! As a matter of fact I shot portraits of Mr. Huckabee last year when he was getting his campaign set up!
McCain is okay in my book, so don't start littering his name in you post if ya don't mind, it's people like you that bring real men down just by the mere fact you sling his name around and post such crap as you have posted!

PS Please spell check your post - you need to in a bad way! I did not delete your post the Mods did - as a matter of fact I did not even report the post! Have a good day!


mikehunter wrote:
QUOTE:
hey photowoman

who do you want to win, obama or hillary? it doesn't matter who you vore for, so stay home. mccain is headed to a landslide victory, and my pal flew with him so i might be going to dinner at the white house while you are throwing mud at a real american, like me. go back to france, where all the people smell, like you.
 
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#4506
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Re:Is it okay to videotape the police? 5 Years, 2 Months ago  
I accept your apology. Huckleberry is ok, although i was a little concerned about his missing tooth which is visable when he smiles. The leader of the free world missing teeth? of course, he could be missing all his teeth and have sex with goats and i would still vote for him over barack huessein obama or hillary. it is so much fun for me to see the dems imploding.

i envision a hot, sticky august night, the super delagates go against barack heussein obama and the popular vote and insert hillary, riots break out all over the country, and the reps take back the house and senate, YEA BABY!!!

thanks for not ratting out my post, but the mods will do what they will do.
 
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#4524
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Re:Is it okay to videotape the police? 5 Years, 2 Months ago  
Don't misconscrew my post as anything close to an apology - I have nothing to be sorry for! It was you that was out of line enough to get a post removed not me brother!


mikehunter wrote:
QUOTE:
I accept your apology. Huckleberry is ok, although i was a little concerned about his missing tooth which is visable when he smiles. The leader of the free world missing teeth? of course, he could be missing all his teeth and have sex with goats and i would still vote for him over barack huessein obama or hillary. it is so much fun for me to see the dems imploding.

i envision a hot, sticky august night, the super delagates go against barack heussein obama and the popular vote and insert hillary, riots break out all over the country, and the reps take back the house and senate, YEA BABY!!!

thanks for not ratting out my post, but the mods will do what they will do.
 
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#4554
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Re:Is it okay to videotape the police? 5 Years, 2 Months ago  
mikehunter wrote:
QUOTE:
I accept your apology. Huckleberry is ok, although i was a little concerned about his missing tooth which is visable when he smiles. The leader of the free world missing teeth? of course, he could be missing all his teeth and have sex with goats and i would still vote for him over barack huessein obama or hillary. it is so much fun for me to see the dems imploding.

i envision a hot, sticky august night, the super delagates go against barack heussein obama and the popular vote and insert hillary, riots break out all over the country, and the reps take back the house and senate, YEA BABY!!!

thanks for not ratting out my post, but the mods will do what they will do.

This is not a political forum.

Thanks
 
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#4681
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Re:Is it okay to videotape the police? 5 Years, 2 Months ago  
Billy Mack wrote:
QUOTE:
Under Georgia's very liberal Open Records Act, it would still go to the media.

I don't have video in my car, so that person recording the incident probably has the only true record of the event. That should show my need to use force, and the appropriateness of the force that I applied. Once the perp's secured, then I could approach the guy with the camera, identify him as a witness, get a written statement, and get a copy of it.

Under the Fourth Amendment and with probable cause, I can seize any evidence that is in plain view. That would include someone filming a crime scene.

Realistically, I'd try to work it out with the guy so that we could copy it. If I have my laptop and he has his camera bag, I can probably record just about anything to digital pretty quickly. If not, he's going to have to wait a day or two to get the property out of evidence.

I'm not going to let evidence be destroyed.


Do you think the police officers should have seized the video in this case:

http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/stories.nsf/stlouiscitycounty/story/B8A7548DC9EF17A286257410000F8BCA?OpenDocument
 
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“If something happens, either we can respond really fast or we could respond really slow. . . . I’m the difference between you getting a two-minute response time, if you needed a little help, or a 15 minutes response time.”
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#4693
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Re:Is it okay to videotape the police? 5 Years, 2 Months ago  
I have had a little interaction with Darrows, this kids story is solid!

He was assaulted by an off duty cop - has been illegally harassed several times, and that and only that is the reason he placed the DV in his vehicle.

The following link is to the video of he and the "officer"
WARNING: the officer’s language is pretty "ADULT" and there is a annoying ticking coming from the Radar Detector in Darrows vehicle.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-2715792117793977759

Pretty odd that the "officer's" dash cam video was destroyed or lost - if this young man had not had his tape running we would not be hearing about this incident. The cop would have called him a liar and nothing would have been done. Notice how the mood changes when the second cop on the scene notifies Sgt. James Kuehnlein that Darrows had a video camera running.

Here is the first encounter Darrows filmed with his "in car set up"
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2585482423715017278

This is just another reason for every officer to have a personal DVR and it go to a third party... And before any LEO's says oh he was baiting the cop - well if that is the case then why did the officer’s video disappear.

St. George Police Chief Scott Uhrig, is one of those gypsy cops we all hear about. Seems he attempted to solicit sex from a 17 year old girl while on the force at another PD here is his response to that:
QUOTE:
I attempted to be completely honest with the public regarding the incident with an officer from this department. I contacted the media first, because the St. George Police Department has nothing to hide and is going to do the right thing with the investigation according with all Missouri State guidelines and rules.

Now the media wants to attack me for an incident that I was accused of seven years ago, that I did not do. Seven Years ago, it was a very political time at the Arnold Police Department. I was wrongfully accused and reprimanded for something that I never did. In conclusion with that, Missouri’s Peace Officers Standard Training also reprimanded me for the same thing I did not do.

I paid my dues for an alleged allegation I never did. My family had to suffer the consequences by the media posting it all over the television and newspapers. My family had to live through it once, and now you making my family live through it again.

This incident that I was accused of seven years ago does not anything to do with the current situation.

So I will not be speaking to the media, and will only contact the media by email to advise them of the findings of the investigation.

If any media attempts to contact me, it will be “No Comment”.

Respectfully,
Chief Scott Uhrig


It is important to remember here that, if not for the video camera that Darrow installed in his car, nothing would have happened and St. Kuehnlein would have gotten away with his actions. He would do the very thing he expressed a willingness to do -- lie. Darrow could complain. Kuehnlein would go in and lie about the situation claiming that this "smart mouth kid" had tried to push him but that he was the paragon of patience and refused to rise to the bait. And Darrow would have been ignored. If others can afford to install video surveillance into their cars it wouldn't be a bad thing. And if you don't have the funds to install one it wouldn't hurt to put up a dummy camera.

The reality is that private citizens need to keep the police under surveillance, as this case proved. It is one way of keeping them under control.

And don't get the wrong impression about Uhrig -- he still is suspicious of anyone who makes cops look bad -- there has to be something wrong with them. Fox News reported that "the chief... also questions Darrow's motives." They quote the Uhrig saying: "Most people commuting back and forth to work don't keep their car outfitted with video recording devices and audio devices." So obviously Darrow is suspicious because he does. Darrow says he outfitted his car with the camera after he received a traffic ticket which he said was bogus but he couldn't prove it. And while a traffic cop can't prove his claims, in most cases, his word is taken above that of the accused -- the reality is that many courts assume you are guilty until proven innocent and a cop's word is sufficient to prove guilt.



Another thing that is not said in this article is that a few days after this incident Darrows recorded an officer stakeing out his house - retaliation for the "trouble he caused"
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5591813350444656353

They towed his legally parked car and no one at the PD could tell him why, he stopped the tow truck driver and paid him $55 to drop the car... Darrows believes they were trying to get to his Video Set-up!

I have a DVR in both my vehicles with 360 degree coverage - I will not post my set up online for the simple reason I want no LEO to know how it is set up. I did this after my incident, I also do not go outside my home without a personal DVR, my home & property is covered with digital video. My system is covert and would take a seasoned investigator the better part of the day to find and another couple of days to figure out.

Now why in this day and age should the GP be required to do this just to protect his/her rights and protection against the very people that are sworn to uphold the law? We pay taxes for LEO's services and then we are required to go to these extremes to protect ourselves - and LE wonders why they have lost the publics trust? If after reading this post and looking at the information you don't realize there is a problem then the GP & LE are at an impasse that will break the trust down even more!

Oh I almost forgot to mention the Mayor of this fine jurisdiction:
St. George — The mayor of this tiny but recently infamous community resigned Tuesday, a day after he was arrested for misdemeanor drug possession, a city official said.

Mayor Harold Goodman, elected last year, was arrested Monday night by St. Louis County authorities, Alderman Carmen Wilkerson said.

Board president Heather Hediger is serving as acting mayor, Wilkerson said.

"I think she'll do a good job representing the city," Wilkerson said of Hediger. "That's why we selected her (as board president)."

Goodman and Hediger could not be reached for comment. St. Louis County authorities, who reportedly made the arrest, also could not be reached.

Aldermen will hold a special public meeting at 7:30 p.m. Thursday for residents of the community of about 1,500 to discuss the situation, Wilkerson said. Advertisement

Several aldermen said they learned about the arrest from reporters.

"I didn't know a thing about it," before a neighbor saw it on television, said Alderman Paul Keene. "I haven't been able to find out anything."

He said Goodman was a former police officer who had taken early retirement because of illness. Goodman won election in a three-way race in which the incumbent mayor was challenged by his wife while the two were in the process of getting a divorce.

St. George, a one-fifth square mile hamlet at Interstate 55 and Reavis Barracks Road in south St. Louis County, landed in the national spotlight recently after a video of a police sergeant yelling at a motorist went public. The officer was fired.

Wilkerson said she's tired of seeing her town in the news.

"It's a charming little community," she said
 
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